KratingDaang
Donator
I can criticize the EU all I want. Don't know what you mean.
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A 'wolfsangel' is not a Nazi symbol
- Thread starter -bZ-LongTrang1
- Start date
I can criticize the EU all I want. Don't know what you mean.
I think it's safe to say that basically everything you hear from them is bullshit. Not saying that we don't like, but their propaganda machine is insane. They lie about everything.
French woman faces trial, €12,000 fine for 'insulting' Macron on Facebook
A woman in northern France is to be put on trial on charges of insulting President Emmanuel Macron after describing him as 'filth' in a Facebook post, a prosecutor said on Wednesday. The woman risks…
www.france24.com
French woman faces trial, €12,000 fine for 'insulting' Macron on Facebook
A woman in northern France is to be put on trial on charges of insulting President Emmanuel Macron after describing him as 'filth' in a Facebook post, a prosecutor said on Wednesday. The woman risks a fine of 12,000 euros but not prison if convicted at the trial due to be held in June.
Dad_E_RaZz
Donator
Just put Titties as your emblem and you will only have to worry about the idiots at EA telling you that its offensive and they will ban your account if you don't remove it.
So all you have to do is cover them with a see thru bra and its all good....
So all you have to do is cover them with a see thru bra and its all good....
Covert8645
-bZ- Member
I don’t know why longtrang is doing an origin lesson… I never said that the symbols originated from Nazi Germany, only mentioned it’s current usage. The “Z” which are on Russian vehicles is not reflective of a wolfsangel, but instead it is identical to the Greek capital “zeta,” which is also the same as the Cyrillic letter 3, or Ze, in the Russian alphabet. There are other vehicle markings other than “Z” such as the letters V and O. Other speculations are that it stands for “zapad” or “West.” There are many speculations on the origins and meanings of these symbols.
Easier speculation is that it’s simply an identifier for friendly forces. Taking American military markings for example the /\ \/ < > symbols are chevrons which indicate friendly vehicles and also as to which company the vehicles belong to. Just as in WWII the black and white stripes that were on fuselages and wings of allied aircraft indicated they were the goodies. The “Z” markings were noticed to be similar to the ones used in the invasion of Czechoslovakia and many remark that these symbols are simply identifiers.
The black sun symbol had other origins as well, yes, but it is most widely known for, and is still in current use with white supremacy.
The 1st Reconnaissance Battalion of the United States Marines have a “death’s head” on it as well, which differed from the “death’s head” used by the Nazis, but again, in context, the USMC Recon community is not fascist, neo-Nazi, or anything silly as such.
Even the U.S. Army has had Swastikas on their uniforms as well. Again, context.
Azov battalion was created May 5th, 2014, in Mariupol Ukraine but it was first founded in May 2014 by volunteers (National Guard) and it is an official part of the Ukrainian military. While some iterations of the “wolfsangel” in the Azov brigade’s emblem does not sport the black son, the use and context of it is what’s important. While longtrang says “I personally don’t GAF if they run around saying “Heil Hitler” all the live long day so long as they’re fighting and bleeding for their country.” That’s a pretty retarded thing to say. There were other people running around and saying the same thing, fighting and bleeding for their country too… I think your subjective stance is a bit skewed.
As to The0bamessiah and speaking on Ukraine, a country with a Jewish president and which is full of Slavs – is Nazi and it being ridiculous is in itself ridiculous. The U.S. military have had gangs, black panthers, white supremacists, and other groups in its midst when we have had white/black presidents doesn’t mean anything. The United States has still never confirmed the existence of Delta Force either, but it still exists.
You can do a search and find dozens of articles about Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem and the Azov battalion’s growth with it. Wagner is rife with them as well, that’s a fact. I’m just showing there’s fuckery on both sides.
The invasion was from Ukraine being a neutral state to wanting to join NATO. Further encroachment upon Russia from NATO would seem like hostile intent and expanded further to the East by way of Ukraine would put us right on Russia’s doorstep. I understand what Russia is doing just as I understand what Ukraine is doing.
Remember when the USMC Scout Sniper community came under attack from the photo of them in Afghanistan with a “SS” flag behind them? Again, context is key. The Marine Scout Sniper community has been using the “SS” runes for decades. Every sniper I served and worked with had “SS” on their rifles, tattoos, flag, spray painted on their pelican cases… you name it, scout snipers had it on there much like how the Marine Corps puts the eagle, globe, and anchor on everything too.
The Marine Scout Snipers have never had a history of fascism, white supremacy, or any negative connotations (unless you think of killing as negative). Even the OFFICIAL USMC Scout Sniper association has the “SS” symbol. Again, context is important. When I was in the Marines, “SS” for Scout Snipers was plastered everywhere throughout their companies.
As far as the origin and meanings of the symbols which were the meaning for this thread, context is important, yes. The Azov brigade’s “wolfsangel” in the context to the Azov’s rising, installment, and current use is that of neo-Naziism. "In 2005, Andriy Biletsky recreated the Kharkiv-based Patriot of Ukraine (PU) to champion white nationalist, anti-immigrant, extreme-right ideas in Ukraine. PU had previously been active during the 1990s and early 2000s. In November 2008, Biletsky also created the umbrella Social Nationalist Assembly (SNA) movement.[6] The movement was a derivative of the earlier political party Social-National Party of Ukraine (SNPU), which later became known as Svoboda. The SNA contained members from a collection of nationalist and extreme-right groups in Ukraine which promoted a neo-Nazi ideology.[7] The PU became the de facto armed wing of the SNA. The PU also championed far-right, white supremacist ideas; in 2010, Biletsky claimed it was Ukraine’s national mission to “lead the white races of the world in a final crusade…against semite-led untermenschen (subhumans)”[8], according to Stanford University.
Furthermore, Stanford University also cited "During the Battle for Mariupol, the group came to attention for its neo-Nazi iconography on the battlefield. Specifically, the battalion patch, which featured an inverted Wolfsangel symbol superimposed on a Black Sun.[15] The Wolsfangel is a historical symbol of independence that was later co-opted by the German Nazi Party. The Black Sun symbol is based on a design commissioned by SS leader Heinrich Himmler, and overwhelmingly used by neo-Nazi and esoteric National Socialist movements.[16] While Azov leaders downplayed the group as a white supremacist or neo-Nazi organization, its patch was and continues to be widely considered a coded reference to modern far-right ideology.[17] The movement denies the logo’s far-right associations, claiming the Wolfsangel is an amalgamation of the letters “I” and “N” or “Idea of the Nation.”[18]
In October 2014, Biletsky left the group to launch a successful political campaign for a seat in Ukraine’s Parliament as an independent candidate. By leveraging his unit’s victory in Mariupol, he secured a seat which he retained until 2019.[19]"
On November 12, 2014, Ukraine designated the Azov Battalion a “Special Purpose Regiment” and formally integrated it into the National Guard, within the Ukrainian Interior Ministry.[20] In December 2014, the PU formally disbanded and remaining members integrated into the Azov Regiment.[21]
Easier speculation is that it’s simply an identifier for friendly forces. Taking American military markings for example the /\ \/ < > symbols are chevrons which indicate friendly vehicles and also as to which company the vehicles belong to. Just as in WWII the black and white stripes that were on fuselages and wings of allied aircraft indicated they were the goodies. The “Z” markings were noticed to be similar to the ones used in the invasion of Czechoslovakia and many remark that these symbols are simply identifiers.
The black sun symbol had other origins as well, yes, but it is most widely known for, and is still in current use with white supremacy.
The 1st Reconnaissance Battalion of the United States Marines have a “death’s head” on it as well, which differed from the “death’s head” used by the Nazis, but again, in context, the USMC Recon community is not fascist, neo-Nazi, or anything silly as such.
Even the U.S. Army has had Swastikas on their uniforms as well. Again, context.
Azov battalion was created May 5th, 2014, in Mariupol Ukraine but it was first founded in May 2014 by volunteers (National Guard) and it is an official part of the Ukrainian military. While some iterations of the “wolfsangel” in the Azov brigade’s emblem does not sport the black son, the use and context of it is what’s important. While longtrang says “I personally don’t GAF if they run around saying “Heil Hitler” all the live long day so long as they’re fighting and bleeding for their country.” That’s a pretty retarded thing to say. There were other people running around and saying the same thing, fighting and bleeding for their country too… I think your subjective stance is a bit skewed.
As to The0bamessiah and speaking on Ukraine, a country with a Jewish president and which is full of Slavs – is Nazi and it being ridiculous is in itself ridiculous. The U.S. military have had gangs, black panthers, white supremacists, and other groups in its midst when we have had white/black presidents doesn’t mean anything. The United States has still never confirmed the existence of Delta Force either, but it still exists.
You can do a search and find dozens of articles about Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem and the Azov battalion’s growth with it. Wagner is rife with them as well, that’s a fact. I’m just showing there’s fuckery on both sides.
The invasion was from Ukraine being a neutral state to wanting to join NATO. Further encroachment upon Russia from NATO would seem like hostile intent and expanded further to the East by way of Ukraine would put us right on Russia’s doorstep. I understand what Russia is doing just as I understand what Ukraine is doing.
Remember when the USMC Scout Sniper community came under attack from the photo of them in Afghanistan with a “SS” flag behind them? Again, context is key. The Marine Scout Sniper community has been using the “SS” runes for decades. Every sniper I served and worked with had “SS” on their rifles, tattoos, flag, spray painted on their pelican cases… you name it, scout snipers had it on there much like how the Marine Corps puts the eagle, globe, and anchor on everything too.
The Marine Scout Snipers have never had a history of fascism, white supremacy, or any negative connotations (unless you think of killing as negative). Even the OFFICIAL USMC Scout Sniper association has the “SS” symbol. Again, context is important. When I was in the Marines, “SS” for Scout Snipers was plastered everywhere throughout their companies.
As far as the origin and meanings of the symbols which were the meaning for this thread, context is important, yes. The Azov brigade’s “wolfsangel” in the context to the Azov’s rising, installment, and current use is that of neo-Naziism. "In 2005, Andriy Biletsky recreated the Kharkiv-based Patriot of Ukraine (PU) to champion white nationalist, anti-immigrant, extreme-right ideas in Ukraine. PU had previously been active during the 1990s and early 2000s. In November 2008, Biletsky also created the umbrella Social Nationalist Assembly (SNA) movement.[6] The movement was a derivative of the earlier political party Social-National Party of Ukraine (SNPU), which later became known as Svoboda. The SNA contained members from a collection of nationalist and extreme-right groups in Ukraine which promoted a neo-Nazi ideology.[7] The PU became the de facto armed wing of the SNA. The PU also championed far-right, white supremacist ideas; in 2010, Biletsky claimed it was Ukraine’s national mission to “lead the white races of the world in a final crusade…against semite-led untermenschen (subhumans)”[8], according to Stanford University.
Furthermore, Stanford University also cited "During the Battle for Mariupol, the group came to attention for its neo-Nazi iconography on the battlefield. Specifically, the battalion patch, which featured an inverted Wolfsangel symbol superimposed on a Black Sun.[15] The Wolsfangel is a historical symbol of independence that was later co-opted by the German Nazi Party. The Black Sun symbol is based on a design commissioned by SS leader Heinrich Himmler, and overwhelmingly used by neo-Nazi and esoteric National Socialist movements.[16] While Azov leaders downplayed the group as a white supremacist or neo-Nazi organization, its patch was and continues to be widely considered a coded reference to modern far-right ideology.[17] The movement denies the logo’s far-right associations, claiming the Wolfsangel is an amalgamation of the letters “I” and “N” or “Idea of the Nation.”[18]
In October 2014, Biletsky left the group to launch a successful political campaign for a seat in Ukraine’s Parliament as an independent candidate. By leveraging his unit’s victory in Mariupol, he secured a seat which he retained until 2019.[19]"
On November 12, 2014, Ukraine designated the Azov Battalion a “Special Purpose Regiment” and formally integrated it into the National Guard, within the Ukrainian Interior Ministry.[20] In December 2014, the PU formally disbanded and remaining members integrated into the Azov Regiment.[21]
Attachments
Really? If you're trapped in a house fire and the local franchise of the Nazi Bund shows up to rescue you I take it you'd rather die than accept their help?
You claim to be a Marine and if you did any time in the sandbox then you likely worked with shitbags who make the real Nazis look like a knitting club. But that was the job, wasn't it? It didn't matter that Haji had a nine year old wife and he liked buttfucking six year old boys. You were ordered to work with him and you did.
Same difference here. Would I want the Azov pukes to immigrate to America? Hell no.
Am, I happy that they're killing Russian invaders? Hell yes.
From my understanding the Far Right Nationalism stuff in Ukraine is really only useful to counter Russian Influence in the Region. This basically started in the 1930s.
Ukrainian Nationalists wanted independence from the Soviets that captured Ukraine 8 years Prior and made it into the USSR (Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic) Stepan Bandera (Western Ukrainian folk hero) himself saw how horrible the Nazis were and he saw how horrible the Soviets were. He was freed by the Nazis to combat Russia in the 1940s. At that time many other younger generation Nationalists thought it necessary for Ukrainians to Join the Nazis in a effort to gain their independence from the Soviets. After WW2 the Soviets occupied Ukraine again. Keep in mind all Soviet Satellite states underwent Russification as way of eliminating cultural/language differences for non Russian peoples. This was more prevalent in the Eastern/Southern part of Ukraine where all the Soviet era heavy industry/Sea ports were located. Those in the West despised Russification and rejected it to the best of their abilities. The CIA helped WW2 era Ukrainian Nationalist types flee USSR. The CIA kept operated in Western Ukraine and took advantage of the huge networks of Anti Soviets that these Nationalists had. The CIA worked with Nationalists groups still in the USSR until it’s collapse. After the fall of the USSR Ukraine finally gained its independence. Russia and “The West” smelled fresh blood after Ukraine gained its independence and have been very influential in Ukrainian politics/business. The West still backing this far right Nationalist ideology to combat Russia. These groups with their Ukrainian brand Nationalism mysteriously started popping up left and right in the 00s. After the mess in Maidan, in 2014, the far right groups/militias went to war with the Russian backed separatists. This was the first invasion were unmarked RU troops acted as advisors. These far right groups started becoming very effective as the war against the separatists raged on. The media hailed groups like AZOV as heros and defenders of Ukraine while the bulk of Ukraines military might sat around with outdated equipment, low moral, and a small budget. Meanwhile Western Media talked about how the West was aiding these unsavory far right groups. The word got out and these groups started growing dramatically as a result. Eventually the West govs pressured Ukraine to reel in the far right groups/militias, which they did. Now after the 2nd invasion most of the groups have been disbanded or fully integrated into the Armed Forces of Ukraine. The Far Right groups like Azov were basically sent on suicide missions to stop the Russian advance from the East-South East and to hold AZOV STAHL. The result was the bulk of Azov being KIA or captured.
In my opinion these guys are more similar to Far right Ultra-Nationalists and they are stuck between a rock and a hard place. They cling onto any ideology that brings in fresh blood and money. The reality here is that they are already done for. Should they win against Russia they will be taken over by Western Globalists who suppress nationalism of any kind. Should they lose they will be taken over by Russia, they will lose their independence, and will serve the Kremlin. Either way the Nationalist, Pagan, Nazi stuff is done for and won’t be around much longer to upset the sensibilities of people in foreign nations.
No point worrying about it.
Latin Z As a Symbol of SS And Moscow Aggression
Moscow craves the total annihilation of Ukrainians as a nation
www.promoteukraine.org
A Latin Z – a simplified runic symbol of Wolfsangel (Wolf’s Hook), which was the emblem of the 4th SS Police Armoured Grenadier Division – became the symbol of Moscow’s aggression against Ukraine. The Russians gladly picked up this symbol, placing it on their cars and T-shirts. Moscow’s “Ministry of Truth,” RoskomnadZor, embedded this sign into its title. And in Kazan, the orcs took ill children out of a hospice into the street to line them up in a Z shape in support of the aggressive war.
Covert8645
-bZ- Member
No, dummy. You call the fire department. I get what you’re saying though, but it’s stupid. You were claiming the symbolism used for Azov wasn’t neo-Nazi, it is.
Yes, I’m a Marine. Yes, I’ve spent a lot of time in the “sandbox.” You comparing the atrocities of Nazis to that of “Muslim culture” is a bit off. While I think the latter is abhorrent as well, there’s little to be done about it. The “Hajis” that you mention, the ones that I have personally worked with, were upstanding men who did not partake in such acts, and I would be happy to work with them again.
You seem very confused. You defend Azov symbols and want them to be victorious against the Russians while at the same time calling them pukes and not wanting them to immigrate to America. I, more than many, understand the “lesser of two evils” and the “the enemy of my enemy is my friend” mantra, but you seem very indecisive about it. They were stood up from neo-Nazis. Their symbols were from Nazis. That’s what all of this goofiness started from.
Both sides are wrong. Ukraine was being a slut and trying to join NATO. NATOs encroachment upon Russia’s doorstep is like the Soviet Union putting missiles into Cuba. Russia invades Ukraine to keep that from happening, Ukraine defends itself. I can see the argument for both sides. America has done a lot of fucked up shit and we’re not always the goodies, but if someone invaded my land, I would defend it. It’s a bad situation where both are right and both are wrong where Russia wants to ensure the buffer zone between itself and NATO is kept and Ukraine is defending its land.
lol promoteukraine.org... That's like someone telling you McDonald's is healthy and someone asking how do they know and they bring up an article from McDonald's. Nyet.Latin Z As a Symbol of SS And Moscow Aggression
Moscow craves the total annihilation of Ukrainians as a nation
A Latin Z – a simplified runic symbol of Wolfsangel (Wolf’s Hook), which was the emblem of the 4th SS Police Armoured Grenadier Division – became the symbol of Moscow’s aggression against Ukraine. The Russians gladly picked up this symbol, placing it on their cars and T-shirts. Moscow’s “Ministry of Truth,” RoskomnadZor, embedded this sign into its title. And in Kazan, the orcs took ill children out of a hospice into the street to line them up in a Z shape in support of the aggressive war.
Not at all. Just because I may not like someone doesn't mean I can't be happy that they're busy killing Russians.
Covert8645
-bZ- Member
GySgt Carlos Hathcock, White Feather. What does that have to do with anything?
So you're happy that someone you don't like, who is protecting their land, is killing other people you don't like, who are also protecting their land.
You would be a basket case in a squatters rights case lol.
In any case, this was about symbols, Azov, their usage and meaning behind it. So we've ascertained that Azov = neo-Nazis and further evident by the symbols they utilize. That's really where this should've stopped lol.
Tells me you are what you say you are.
(Stupid enough to join the Marines!
)Ukraine is not Russian land. Russia acknowledged this multiple times from 1991 to 2014.
Covert8645
-bZ- Member
I never said Ukraine was Russian land.Tells me you are what you say you are.
(Stupid enough to join the Marines!
Ukraine is not Russian land. Russia acknowledged this multiple times from 1991 to 2014.
I said Russia is protecting their land. Ukraine trying to join NATO is an imminent threat to Russia. Russia is hitting Ukraine to prevent that and to use Ukrainian land as a buffer against NATO.
Well, I guess the Russians are getting their asses kicked then. Also, I see the war came home to Moscow today.
Covert8645
-bZ- Member
Losses are staggering on both sides.
Ah yes, Oliver Stone, the world-renowned
The reason Russia attacked Ukraine is because it wants to control land that it views as being "its" land. It's revanchism pure and simple. Frankly I think that Sweden should seek to reclaim its rightful lands from the Rus, considering it was Swedish Vikings who first established the Kievan Rus, the direct ancestors of modern Russia. Do you see how ridiculous this sounds, to be pursuing territorial claims based on historic sovereignty?
I understand hating the current US administration - I do too - but come on. It is entirely possible to oppose them on virtually every other policy and still support this one. This is the only thing that both sides should be agreeing on ; Russia is a hostile aggressor invading its neighbor under false pretenses. That any Republicans, apart from some previously self-described isolationists like Rand Paul and other idealogues, are opposed to the Biden administration's support for Ukraine is astonishing and proof that the partisanship in this country is passed the point of no return.
No it's not. NATO is a defensive alliance. It can only be invoked upon outside aggression. This is ludicrous. If Russia has no interest in attacking any of its neighbors then it does not have any reason to worry about NATO. NATO has also been present on its "doorstep" for years with its borders with Latvia, Lithuania, and Estonia - all NATO members - and with Poland bordering its exclave of Kaliningrad and its puppet state of Belarus. Russia has not had a buffer for years. If NATO somehow wanted to invade Russia it has been able to do it directly for decades. Russia does not need a buffer state because no one is intending to invade it.
The reason Russia attacked Ukraine is because it wants to control land that it views as being "its" land. It's revanchism pure and simple. Frankly I think that Sweden should seek to reclaim its rightful lands from the Rus, considering it was Swedish Vikings who first established the Kievan Rus, the direct ancestors of modern Russia. Do you see how ridiculous this sounds, to be pursuing territorial claims based on historic sovereignty?
I understand hating the current US administration - I do too - but come on. It is entirely possible to oppose them on virtually every other policy and still support this one. This is the only thing that both sides should be agreeing on ; Russia is a hostile aggressor invading its neighbor under false pretenses. That any Republicans, apart from some previously self-described isolationists like Rand Paul and other idealogues, are opposed to the Biden administration's support for Ukraine is astonishing and proof that the partisanship in this country is passed the point of no return.
Covert8645
-bZ- Member
I disagree.
And, I don't believe US administrations were brought up at all, so I don't know why the current administration and their supporting policy has anything to do with what's been discussed so far.
"The possibility that NATO enlargement—particularly but not exclusively to Ukraine—helped cause the Russia-Ukraine conflict, instead suggesting without quite saying that homegrown Russian “imperialism” is to blame. In turn, you call for the alliance to admit Ukraine once the conflict ends. I don’t think either this diagnosis of the war’s origins or the recommendation for NATO policy going forward is quite right.
For sure, Russian imperialism is a driver of Russian behavior. Still, whereas you present Russia’s imperial impulse as a better explanation for its invasion of Ukraine than NATO enlargement, I see these as complementary. Russian leaders and many Western analysts warned from the 1990s onward that NATO enlargement would inflame Russian nationalism and imperil East-West relations. Correlation is not causation, but it is striking that what former Russian president Boris Yeltsin and others warned about is exactly what has happened. Put another way, Russian nationalism and imperialism did not develop in a vacuum. By providing nationalists such as President Vladimir Putin with a cause and challenging Russian claims to influence in its near abroad, NATO enlargement shaped the thuggish Russian nationalism we see today. Further NATO enlargement to Ukraine promises to reinforce the situation by playing into the basest of Russian identity." - Joshua Shifrinson
Immunna rEpOrT u